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Herpes, Any Good Reason To "Disclose"?

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  • Herpes, Any Good Reason To "Disclose"?

    Alright, this should be an interesting topic. So a little history about me, I was a virgin until ~24, and then I decided to deal with that problem by spending some time with a pro. Of course it didn't stop there, and I'd estimate I've seen ~15 different women over the course of a year.
    I took all the usual precautions of course, but what they don't tell you in this fun time hookup culture is that not all std's can be avoided by wearing a condom. Hpv and Herpes seem to be the main culprits for stds that a massive percentage of sexually active adults are infected with, often without any visible symptoms.

    Hpv can cause various types of cancer, although it is rare that this occurs. Usually hpv is flushed from the body with no long term symptoms. Herpes is much less dangerous, although in rare cases it can spread to the brain and is somewhat dangerous to infants during child birth.
    From what I have read, many people go their entire lives without having a visible Herpes outbreak, even though they are still capable of transmitting the virus via inconspicuous shedding. Others may occasionally have an outbreak, but it might not progress to visible sores, only going so far as a mild irritation/itch.
    Then of course there are the poor unlucky saps who have full blown visible outbreaks, sores, and scabbing. These are the poor saps that actually have to own up to the fact that they most definitely have herpes, and face the social stigma attached.

    Since condoms are only ~50% effective at preventing Herpes, and it can be spread even when an outbreak isn't occurring, I didn't really believe I'd be able to avoid it forever. As far as I can tell I seem to be a moderate case, a bit of itchiness during an outbreak and no other visible signs. Since they don't have a blood test available for Herps in my part of the world (they only test if sores are visible), I'm pretty much stuck knowing I probably have it but don't "officially" have it.
    I'm not really sure what all the fuss is about, there seems to be a lot of ignorance and a lot of social distancing occurring for something that is essentially little more a nuisance than the common cold. Something that many people probably already have but don't have symptoms, so they can maintain their precious "clean" status.

    I remember a rather intriguing conversation I had with a whore wherein I asked her what she does to protect herself. She was genuinely surprised at the notion that Herpes is often asymptomatic and easily transferable even with condoms, and she was one of the brighter ones.
    So I'm in a bit of a conundrum, as much as I'd like to crush this compulsive honesty bug and just do whatever the hell I like, I know it probably wouldn't do good things for my mental health long term.
    So I leave the discussion to you, the community at large. What would you do if you we're ~75% certain you had herpes but didn't have an official status? Ignore it, disclose everything on the first date, or perhaps only disclose if the topic of stds comes up?

    I feel as though I'm leaning towards a "fuck it" attitude. Perhaps if the medical community took education and prevention of Herps a little more seriously, and there was less societal alarmist thinking surrounding the topic, I might be a little more inclined to think people deserve honesty. I do wonder what's worse, someone born dishonest, or someone compulsively honest who would do anything to get the honesty monkey off their back...
    I seem to have a lot less sympathy for pros than I do for the average girl "innocently" looking to rope a guy into an ltr. Perhaps it's because pros should really already know what they are getting into, or maybe I'm just jaded because I probably got this itch from a pro.
    Last edited by mik1; 03-18-2017, 03:36 PM.

  • #2
    I don't know what your hook up culture is like, so I'll just assume it ain't that different to the local one, but I don't participate there either.

    First dates don't necessarily have to be about sex. Let's assume it isn't. Then it's about getting to know each other, and in the game, it's about best foot forward to see if you want to put more effort in. As such a full list of your personal diseases and watnots isn't vital. But it will be at some point if it goes further.

    When sex is on the cards. Disclosure is important, you should do proper preventative and risk research and your partner should as well, then if you agree take those steps or abstain.

    It doesn't make it impossible to find a sexual partner, after all you do get prospects who have it themselves already ;>

    If you like a woman enough to have sex with her, I'd assume you'd like her enough to help her avoid any form of illness or injury, let alone being the one to pass it to her. That's just kinda common sense. It doesn't matter if it's mild, if it's preventable / there is a risk factor any person has the right to decide for themselves.

    The pro should have respected your right to decide the risk of getting it.
    "...especially when it comes to communication, it can be observed, if it is not a negotiation it's a war."
    Originally posted by menrppl2
    Can't live with em, life is great without them.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by voidspawn View Post
      I don't know what your hook up culture is like, so I'll just assume it ain't that different to the local one, but I don't participate there either.

      First dates don't necessarily have to be about sex. Let's assume it isn't. Then it's about getting to know each other, and in the game, it's about best foot forward to see if you want to put more effort in. As such a full list of your personal diseases and watnots isn't vital. But it will be at some point if it goes further.

      When sex is on the cards. Disclosure is important, you should do proper preventative and risk research and your partner should as well, then if you agree take those steps or abstain.

      It doesn't make it impossible to find a sexual partner, after all you do get prospects who have it themselves already ;>

      If you like a woman enough to have sex with her, I'd assume you'd like her enough to help her avoid any form of illness or injury, let alone being the one to pass it to her. That's just kinda common sense. It doesn't matter if it's mild, if it's preventable / there is a risk factor any person has the right to decide for themselves.

      The pro should have respected your right to decide the risk of getting it.
      ~65% of adults have type 1 herpes, another ~20% of adults have type 2, many don't know they have it/don't present symptoms. I'm really trying to find a good reason to tell someone I may have it when the only evidence I have is a rash. I guess I can just educate people on the reality that they probably already have Herpes, since people seem to be so genuinely naive.

      It will eventually boil down to whether or not I find someone whom I genuinely care about. So far I'm not entirely sure I am capable of such feelings. I mean, I'm kind of hesitant to continue having sex with the pros but I really feel as though they should know better. The only reason I'm even considering this is because of visible symptoms, I've probably got a few dozen strains of hpv as well and couldn't care less about it.
      Last edited by mik1; 03-18-2017, 06:39 PM.

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      • #4
        If the relationship is heading towards a sexual one, the person you're about to have sex with has a right to know, IMO. So, yes you should always disclose before taking things to a sexual level. I don't think it needs to come up on a first date, you might not even want to continue dating the person. But if you sense things are getting serious and sex is going to likely happen, then disclosure is the ethical and responsible thing to do.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by mik1 View Post
          Something like 85% percent of adults have type 1 herpes, another ~50% of adults have type 2, many don't know they have it. I'm really trying to find a good reason to tell someone I may have it when the only evidence I have is a rash. I guess I can just educate people on the reality that they probably already have Herpes, since people seem to be so genuinely naive.

          It will eventually boil down to whether or not I find someone whom I genuinely care about. So far I'm not entirely sure I am capable of such feelings. I mean, I'm kind of hesitant to continue having sex with the pros but I really feel as though they should know better. The only reason I'm even considering this is because of visible symptoms, I've probably got a few dozen strains of hpv as well and couldn't care less about it.
          Sounds like your head and conscience is in the right place. No idea about the morality of disclosure and assumptions with pros. I'd expect a sex worker to have an informed view and practice safe sex. But I don't know what to expect if one did disclose, an additional charge? Hope someone better informed replies to your thread.
          "...especially when it comes to communication, it can be observed, if it is not a negotiation it's a war."
          Originally posted by menrppl2
          Can't live with em, life is great without them.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Deidre View Post
            If the relationship is heading towards a sexual one, the person you're about to have sex with has a right to know, IMO. So, yes you should always disclose before taking things to a sexual level. I don't think it needs to come up on a first date, you might not even want to continue dating the person. But if you sense things are getting serious and sex is going to likely happen, then disclosure is the ethical and responsible thing to do.
            Rights are a funny thing you know? Particularly "rights" that have no chance of enforcement. Nature doesn't recognize rights, society and laws do, as far as I can tell all rights are privileges.
            Or to put it a little less philosophically, I had a rash, something that may or may not be herpes, and they don't test anything other than sores here. So I'm not under any legal obligation to do anything, and any "rights" are in fact null and void.
            Ethics are as varied as the individual, and I grow a little tired of having my responsibility brought up when this forum was founded on the grounds of women actively choosing to avoid responsibility. Do I really owe them anything?

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by voidspawn View Post
              Sounds like your head and conscience is in the right place. No idea about the morality of disclosure and assumptions with pros. I'd expect a sex worker to have an informed view and practice safe sex. But I don't know what to expect if one did disclose, an additional charge? Hope someone better informed replies to your thread.
              You think so? Let me provide an alternative train of thought. Perhaps I just pride myself on my honesty, perhaps I don't really care heads or tails about any individuals, I certainly don't remember caring emotionally for others for quite some time. Pride is an important aspect of a narcissist or sociopath after all. They say narcissists and sociopaths are incapable of such self analysis, but it can be fun to keep people guessing wouldn't you say

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by mik1 View Post
                Rights are a funny thing you know? Particularly "rights" that have no chance of enforcement. Nature doesn't recognize rights, society and laws do, as far as I can tell all rights are privileges.
                Or to put it a little less philosophically, I had a rash, something that may or may not be herpes, and they don't test anything other than sores here. So I'm not under any legal obligation to do anything, and any "rights" are in fact null and void.
                Ethics are as varied as the individual, and I grow a little tired of having my responsibility brought up when this forum was founded on the grounds of women actively choosing to avoid responsibility. Do I really owe them anything?
                If you're going to have sex with someone, and you have a disease that is transmitted through sex, you should tell her. This has nothing to do with feminism or anything else. It is about being responsible. I'd say just wear a condom and whatever but if she has oral sex with you, it can be transmitted that way. It sucks but I think that it is the right thing to do.

                ETA- I think in some states it is illegal to know you have a sexually transmittable disease and not tell unsuspecting partners. I think Charlie Sheen, that actor, was involved in lawsuits for not telling women he had sex with that he has HIV. I mean, you're essentially putting someone in harm's way and not giving them an option to opt out.
                Last edited by Deidre; 03-18-2017, 05:03 PM.

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by Deidre View Post
                  If you're going to have sex with someone, and you have a disease that is transmitted through sex, you should tell her. This has nothing to do with feminism or anything else. It is about being responsible. I'd say just wear a condom and whatever but if she has oral sex with you, it can be transmitted that way. It sucks but I think that it is the right thing to do.

                  ETA- I think in some states it is illegal to know you have a sexually transmittable disease and not tell unsuspecting partners. I think Charlie Sheen, that actor, was involved in lawsuits for not telling women he had sex with that he has HIV. I mean, you're essentially putting someone in harm's way and not giving them an option to opt out.
                  I think in many places it is illegal to be diagnosed with an std and knowingly spread it, but there is a distinctive difference to my situation that I've already mentioned in my op and recent posts eh?
                  I can tell you didn't read it though, as you aren't aware of the ineffectiveness of condoms in preventing skin to skin stds like Herpes and Hpv. Odds are you are carrying a few yourself entirely unaware.
                  Last edited by mik1; 03-18-2017, 05:14 PM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Ah my bad lol ...well, for your own peace of mind, maybe see if you have it, get a proper diagnosis and if you don't, then you have nothing to be concerned over but if you do, I would share it before having sex.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by mik1 View Post
                      You think so? Let me provide an alternative train of thought. Perhaps I just pride myself on my honesty, perhaps I don't really care heads or tails about any individuals, I certainly don't remember caring emotionally for others for quite some time. Pride is an important aspect of a narcissist or sociopath after all. They say narcissists and sociopaths are incapable of such self analysis, but it can be fun to keep people guessing wouldn't you say
                      Can't say I give it much thought. I take my responsibility as member of society, species, etc seriously. On occasion it is fun to know what others think of me, but it's not that important unless something is contingent on it.

                      Sure a person could be just indulging some form of self absorption. Doesn't really matter, whatever process they are going through to get from A to B, they are responsible for. You've asked a question, perhaps you'd like people to say 'do what you want it's all okay', but let's assume you are open to the answers that state responsibility for your own actions is a real thing, your impact on others is a real thing, their right to decide: participate or avoid is a real thing.

                      I think it's interesting pondering what a narcissist or sociopath would do with this question, but it doesn't take much pondering. From experience it tends to go one way, in a pretty tramlined fashion. Internet is internet. It's not very satisfying for a narcissist to realise that even when people engage, they can turn off when they want, even when they stubbornly answer and reply and seem to be on a hook, it's for their own reasons. And that the reality tends towards, all the fun of imagining these people are thinking about them, is just imagination. Most regulars on public forums are using a public voice, even when answering specifically to a person, they are writing with a view that many others are reading and it enters an archive for public perusal, and there is a strong element of responsibility to a group that does erode any narcissistic position as they come to realise that even as an individual they will be cared about in the context of what is good for the group.
                      "...especially when it comes to communication, it can be observed, if it is not a negotiation it's a war."
                      Originally posted by menrppl2
                      Can't live with em, life is great without them.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Deidre View Post
                        Ah my bad lol ...well, for your own peace of mind, maybe see if you have it, get a proper diagnosis and if you don't, then you have nothing to be concerned over but if you do, I would share it before having sex.
                        Difficult to get a proper diagnosis without visible herpes sores. Itchy balls is a little difficult to narrow down aside from "possibly herpes", or "possibly irritation after a hair trim". It's a rather wide inconclusive net. I do appreciate your opinion that it is nothing to be concerned over without an official diagnosis however. One of the key reasons for starting this thread was to gather the mass opinion on whether I am concerning myself with something I need not be.

                        In any case, my willingness to "take responsibility", might just be closely linked with the general population's willingness to "take responsibility" for their ignorance surrounding certain stds, and the hypocritical tendency to shame individuals with visible herpes outbreaks all the while spreading the std incognito themselves. Perhaps that's a tad spiteful, but I guess only time will tell what my final decision will be.

                        Good of you to take the time to chat
                        Last edited by mik1; 03-18-2017, 05:44 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by voidspawn View Post
                          Can't say I give it much thought. I take my responsibility as member of society, species, etc seriously. On occasion it is fun to know what others think of me, but it's not that important unless something is contingent on it.

                          Sure a person could be just indulging some form of self absorption. Doesn't really matter, whatever process they are going through to get from A to B, they are responsible for. You've asked a question, perhaps you'd like people to say 'do what you want it's all okay', but let's assume you are open to the answers that state responsibility for your own actions is a real thing, your impact on others is a real thing, their right to decide: participate or avoid is a real thing.

                          I think it's interesting pondering what a narcissist or sociopath would do with this question, but it doesn't take much pondering. From experience it tends to go one way, in a pretty tramlined fashion. Internet is internet. It's not very satisfying for a narcissist to realise that even when people engage, they can turn off when they want, even when they stubbornly answer and reply and seem to be on a hook, it's for their own reasons. And that the reality tends towards, all the fun of imagining these people are thinking about them, is just imagination. Most regulars on public forums are using a public voice, even when answering specifically to a person, they are writing with a view that many others are reading and it enters an archive for public perusal, and there is a strong element of responsibility to a group that does erode any narcissistic position as they come to realise that even as an individual they will be cared about in the context of what is good for the group.
                          Aye, but we hide things from others intentionally and unintentionally all the time, acting based on what we believe will or will not have an effect on others, positive or negative. There is such a thing as responsibility, but where the line is drawn is based on an individuals given set of ethics/moral values.

                          I honestly can't say I have much of a vested interest in the good of an internet forum, I enjoy posting here and engaging in debate, so I do. Perhaps I am a narc, but you will never meet a more direct/honest narc

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by mik1 View Post
                            Aye, but we hide things from others intentionally and unintentionally all the time, acting based on what we believe will or will not have an effect on others, positive or negative. There is such a thing as responsibility, but where the line is drawn is based on an individuals given set of ethics/moral values.

                            I honestly can't say I have much of a vested interest in the good of an internet forum, I enjoy posting here and engaging in debate, so I do. Perhaps I am a narc, but you will never meet a more direct/honest narc
                            We can draw lines about what we hide or reveal. There is a pile of information that isn't other people's business. Circumstances may make it there business such as having sex with someone with STDs, that shifts it. But sitting next to someone on the subway doesn't place a responsibility to disclose, regardless of how cool or panicked the person might be.

                            I like this forum because it's attached to men's rights, which I care about. There are many people who care about the same thing. I think a place like this is very useful and helpful. Part of the use is the diversity of being a public forum, posters don't have to have any particular POV. It joins the chat, rumbles around, gets commented and cogitated, something pops out.

                            What you may or may not be is your question, to which I hope you have or find an answer that is helpful for you. The posts you've added are interesting, the debate is helpful. You certainly don't need to be a 'believer' or a cause member or anything like that. I don't think there is anything like that here really, other than undercurrent themes of support for men's rights and anti-feminism.
                            "...especially when it comes to communication, it can be observed, if it is not a negotiation it's a war."
                            Originally posted by menrppl2
                            Can't live with em, life is great without them.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by voidspawn View Post
                              We can draw lines about what we hide or reveal. There is a pile of information that isn't other people's business. Circumstances may make it there business such as having sex with someone with STDs, that shifts it. But sitting next to someone on the subway doesn't place a responsibility to disclose, regardless of how cool or panicked the person might be.

                              I like this forum because it's attached to men's rights, which I care about. There are many people who care about the same thing. I think a place like this is very useful and helpful. Part of the use is the diversity of being a public forum, posters don't have to have any particular POV. It joins the chat, rumbles around, gets commented and cogitated, something pops out.

                              What you may or may not be is your question, to which I hope you have or find an answer that is helpful for you. The posts you've added are interesting, the debate is helpful. You certainly don't need to be a 'believer' or a cause member or anything like that. I don't think there is anything like that here really, other than undercurrent themes of support for men's rights and anti-feminism.
                              Feminism has been going on for a long time, and privileges are added for women everyday. Men's rights groups on the other hand have accomplished very little, through no fault of their own. You see, as long as ~90% of men pander to women, and 90% of women pander to women, we are going to be stuck. Sure we can gradually lower the number of white knights, but it will take a long while to reach 90% of men standing up for their rights.

                              I view this forum as a fun place to identify the poisoned well for what it is, and to vent frustrations, but I have no illusions that we are moving at anything more than a snails pace toward men's rights. Unless you discover the cure for aging you are unlikely to see a paradigm shift in your lifetime. Well I suppose violent societal collapse brought on by certain third world nations is a possibility, but it doesn't sound particularly pleasant, and will likely only balance gender rights via the removal of rights in general.

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