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  • A Challenge for MRA's and Anti-Fems

    A Challenge for MRA's and Anti-Fems




    Recently I was in a conversation discussing the similarities and differences between the MHRM and Feminism. Generally whenever I'm in such a discussion, the general tone and tenor is "Hurr Durr we're nothing like them"-- with all sorts of points to equality and inclusion (which I agree with by the way)-- but I think we are similar to Feminism in one very, very, very important way....

    I have thought about this for a while now. And I have searched for a long, long time how exactly to articulate what I mean-- and I recently, I think I have come up with a way to say what I mean, and it's this:

    Feminists NEVER have anything good to say about men-- ever. And of course they bash men relentlessly at every opportunity and never miss an opportunity to unleash some good old-fashioned Man-Hate.

    Sadly, I have rarely heard the MHRM say anything good about women either. And that bothers me. While I don't think we spend anywhere near as much time "bashing" women as Feminists do men-- (I mean like orders of magnitude less)-- and I do think we do sort-of bash women from time to time, so we're maybe guilty of at least that. On the other hand, we don't really spend any time saying what we LIKE about them either. And one of the "crimes" of Feminism (IMO) is the steady erosion of esteem, respect and good-will for men by women that Feminists constantly engage in, both overtly and through omission, insinuation and innuendo-- and their steady daily spewage of "Woman Good, Man Bad" effluvium.

    In general, I wish WE folks in the MHRM, and the Anti-Feminism camps, would do more, say more, reach out more to regular women-- and men too for that matter-- and just say GOOD THINGS about them. Say the things we LIKE about them. Appreciate them. Help them understand that WE THINK and FEEL like they are a part of the human race and not just "the other side" or "the opposition".

    SO HERE IS MY CHALLENGE...

    Take this opportunity to come up with a comment below saying some of the NICE, GOOD, WHOLESOME, DECENT things you think about WOMEN, from your perspective as a member of either the MHRM or as an Anti-Feminist. Feel free to also say the same about Men. I don't intend this to be seen as another opportunity to bash men.

    I am hoping people will get into the spirit of this and show the world-- show FEMINISTS-- what is REALLY AND TRULY *DIFFERENT* about *US* that *THEY* will never understand.

    We love and care about each other.

    ---

    Reject Feminism. Embrace Humanity.
    Last edited by mr_e; 08-24-2017, 10:59 PM.
    FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
    It's time to call it out for what it is.



    The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men

    http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

  • #2
    Best way to say something nice is to acknowledge and respect what people do.

    This list is in no particular order and is off the top of my head so very incomplete.

    Karen Straughan - spoke out when it was really unpopular to even dare make a peep about men's rights or feminist excesses. Women who have courage have a lot of courage, they use their brains and hearts to do what is right.
    Alison Tieman - has consistently spoke and educated from a rational, free speech, freedom of thought perspective. She's defended justice and principles but also spoke about good ways of effecting change.
    Diana Davidson - worked hard for years both making informative youtube content challenging false accusation and fighting in court to defend the innocent.
    Hannah Wallen - one of the most clam, rational yet passionate defenders of rights one could ever hope would stand up for what is right.
    Camille Paglia - a feminist but an honest one, has not wavered from wanting to see a world where men and women work together side by side as equals for the good of all.
    Christina Hoff Summers - she could have banked a lot of bucks supporting false feminist statistics but she chose to support actual facts.
    Lara Stemple - a professional and dedicated researcher, never swayed by politics has endlessly tried to get the full facts about domestic and sexual violence into the public discourse, her work will save many lives from violence and misery.
    Bettina Arndt - has come to be a great spokeswoman for healthy sexual relations and showing empathy for the pain and loneliness that blights many lives.
    Erin Pizzey - as courageous and honest as the best of humanity, she watched her work to protect all people from domestic violence get hi-jacked but never wavered and still actively campaigns today to end the warped Duluth Model and see the end to the cycles of domestic violence.
    Anne Cools - a woman who started in the fight against racism, supporting battered women who has earned higher position and taken her work to addressing even greater issues of injustice, she has epitomised the struggle against all injustice.

    This list is no way complete, there are lots more but it's pretty good example set of what is good about women, that said in a man's way is saying the good that women do that shows what they are.

    Each one of them could have taken an easier path, could have had money and praise heaped on them if they'd used their strength, intelligence, wit and passion to hammer and attack men. Instead they chose to seek to make the world a place where the right thing is done. I don't know if an average woman reading this would understand this sentiment, but I personally will never let go of the thought of what the world could be like or will be like when women and men show the character and integrity demonstrated by the women in this admittedly small sample from many.

    Each of these has shown how to be above all things, a decent human being.
    "...especially when it comes to communication, it can be observed, if it is not a negotiation it's a war."
    Originally posted by menrppl2
    Can't live with em, life is great without them.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by mr_e View Post
      SO HERE IS MY CHALLENGE...
      Cant mate too busy, the missus and I are going to cull that Cankered Cyprus
      "Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one" - Charles Mackay

      And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; It tolls for thee. - Donne

      "What we are seeing in this headless misandry is a grand display of the Tyranny of the Underdog: 'I am a wretchedly longstanding victim; therefore I own no burden of adult accountability, nor need to honor any restraint against my words and actions. In fact, all efforts to restrain me are only further proof of my oppressed condition.'
      "It is the most perfect trump-card against accountable living ever devised." - Gladden Schrock

      "What remains for most men in modern life is a world of expectation without reward, burden without honor and service without self" - Paul Elam

      Comment


      • #4
        I would like to acknowledge and thank all those wonderful women who aren't Feminists, who don't bash men because they're "bad" and "evil", who do their best to live decently and provide good, wholesome role-models to their children, and are good wives to their husbands. There are many of these good and kind-hearted women out there who we don't see or notice on a regular daily basis-- who aren't out to nail men to a cross, or turn themselves into helpless victims, or demand special rights or privileges. We just don't get to hear about them generally because the Feminists are the ones who tend to use up all the oxygen in the room- and crowd them out of the news cycle.
        FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
        It's time to call it out for what it is.



        The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men

        http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by voidspawn View Post
          Best way to say something nice is to acknowledge and respect what people do.

          This list is in no particular order and is off the top of my head so very incomplete.

          Karen Straughan - spoke out when it was really unpopular to even dare make a peep about men's rights or feminist excesses. Women who have courage have a lot of courage, they use their brains and hearts to do what is right.
          Alison Tieman - has consistently spoke and educated from a rational, free speech, freedom of thought perspective. She's defended justice and principles but also spoke about good ways of effecting change.
          Diana Davidson - worked hard for years both making informative youtube content challenging false accusation and fighting in court to defend the innocent.
          Hannah Wallen - one of the most clam, rational yet passionate defenders of rights one could ever hope would stand up for what is right.
          Camille Paglia - a feminist but an honest one, has not wavered from wanting to see a world where men and women work together side by side as equals for the good of all.
          Christina Hoff Summers - she could have banked a lot of bucks supporting false feminist statistics but she chose to support actual facts.
          Lara Stemple - a professional and dedicated researcher, never swayed by politics has endlessly tried to get the full facts about domestic and sexual violence into the public discourse, her work will save many lives from violence and misery.
          Bettina Arndt - has come to be a great spokeswoman for healthy sexual relations and showing empathy for the pain and loneliness that blights many lives.
          Erin Pizzey - as courageous and honest as the best of humanity, she watched her work to protect all people from domestic violence get hi-jacked but never wavered and still actively campaigns today to end the warped Duluth Model and see the end to the cycles of domestic violence.
          Anne Cools - a woman who started in the fight against racism, supporting battered women who has earned higher position and taken her work to addressing even greater issues of injustice, she has epitomised the struggle against all injustice.

          This list is no way complete, there are lots more but it's pretty good example set of what is good about women, that said in a man's way is saying the good that women do that shows what they are.

          Each one of them could have taken an easier path, could have had money and praise heaped on them if they'd used their strength, intelligence, wit and passion to hammer and attack men. Instead they chose to seek to make the world a place where the right thing is done. I don't know if an average woman reading this would understand this sentiment, but I personally will never let go of the thought of what the world could be like or will be like when women and men show the character and integrity demonstrated by the women in this admittedly small sample from many.

          Each of these has shown how to be above all things, a decent human being.


          Thanks for your post. I agree with all of your selections. And there are so many more-- they are all around us and we just don't always see them or take the time to acknowledge them. I think we need to start a campaign of POSITIVITY in the MHRM. We don't have to stop "FUCKING THEIR SHIT UP" to do it, because that's important too. But if all we do is accuse and snarl, we quickly start sounding like the ones we oppose. I have often challenged Feminists to show me the love. My goal in this is to show the Feminists that MRA's *AREN'T* haters like they are. We appreciate women. We simply don't appreciate Feminism.

          I would like to add Suzy McCarley to the list, who along with a number of others, performs a terrific job moderating the AVoiceForMen main site.
          FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
          It's time to call it out for what it is.



          The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men

          http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by mr_e View Post
            Thanks for your post. I agree with all of your selections. And there are so many more-- they are all around us and we just don't always see them or take the time to acknowledge them. I think we need to start a campaign of POSITIVITY in the MHRM. We don't have to stop "FUCKING THEIR SHIT UP" to do it, because that's important too. But if all we do is accuse and snarl, we quickly start sounding like the ones we oppose. I have often challenged Feminists to show me the love. My goal in this is to show the Feminists that MRA's *AREN'T* haters like they are. We appreciate women. We simply don't appreciate Feminism.

            I would like to add Suzy McCarley to the list, who along with a number of others, performs a terrific job moderating the AVoiceForMen main site.
            I would definitely agree, she's part of the hardworking behind the scenes grafters. I always enjoy seeing her posts and moderating comments. She's got a splendid direct way about her, and kindness and fairness to her tone.
            "...especially when it comes to communication, it can be observed, if it is not a negotiation it's a war."
            Originally posted by menrppl2
            Can't live with em, life is great without them.

            Comment


            • #7
              Women have a unique and miraculous ability to, from a mere glance or nod, identify me as a sub-human piece of garbage that should have the good grace to know better than to cause them the discomfort of knowing that I noticed them. So they've got that going for them. We'd all be so lucky to have that level of discernment.
              "...but when she goes off you, she will not just walk away, she will walk away with your fucking skin in a jar." ~~ DoctorRandomercam
              "The laws of man, they don't apply when blood gets in a woman's eye" - The Black Keys

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Mifune View Post
                Women have a unique and miraculous ability to, from a mere glance or nod, identify me as a sub-human piece of garbage that should have the good grace to know better than to cause them the discomfort of knowing that I noticed them. So they've got that going for them. We'd all be so lucky to have that level of discernment.
                LOL! Too funny ;-)
                FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
                It's time to call it out for what it is.



                The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men

                http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by mr_e View Post
                  LOL! Too funny ;-)
                  Maybe from where you sit.
                  "...but when she goes off you, she will not just walk away, she will walk away with your fucking skin in a jar." ~~ DoctorRandomercam
                  "The laws of man, they don't apply when blood gets in a woman's eye" - The Black Keys

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Mifune View Post
                    Maybe from where you sit.
                    If you ever want to have the last laugh, go get yourself a fancy suit, shine your shoes and put on a big gold ring. Then go to any club in town and the women will fawn over you. When you're ready to leave, toss back your drink and say "Goodnight ladies" and watch them hiss like cats.
                    FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
                    It's time to call it out for what it is.



                    The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men

                    http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by mr_e View Post
                      A Challenge for MRA's and Anti-Fems
                      I'll pass on that, as not suited for the task.

                      But let me say this:
                      The MHRM differs from the feminists in what kind of society is envisioned in the end. I'll omit giving detail, I'm sure you can fill in the blanks.
                      But that is a matter of long term strategy.

                      When it comes to day-to-day tactics, yes, MRAs think, speak and act like Feminists, and should do so, too.
                      Deconstructing the cultural messages about sex and gender is hard work, but a crucially necessary one.
                      A dirty job, but someone's got to do it.

                      And being an MRA doesn't mean you can't say nice things about e.g. Karen S..
                      It just means that one says nice things about Karen S. because she's Karen S., not because she is a woman.
                      Karen S. is a good person; however, that goodness is not rooted in her womanhood, but in her Karenhood.

                      Perhaps time to eliminate the gender perspective, here, too?

                      M

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Regarding Erin Pizzey, who was mentioned by Voidspawn. Erin started refuges for women who are victims of domestic violence in the seventies, giving her time, her money and working very hard. I did some decorating in one of the refuges she started, in the seventies, and saw what a vital escape they provided for women fleeing violent partners.
                        But! Why isn't Erin a heroine to feminists? She's done more to help battered women than all the feminist professors, teachers of 'women studies', feminist authors and journalists put together. Because she says the feminist analysis of 'evil men batter women', is to simple, and plain wrong. So despite her admirable work, to feminists she's a traitor. Saving the lives of women, as Erin has, counts for nothing if she doesn't accept feminist orthodoxy.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Manalysis View Post
                          I'll pass on that, as not suited for the task.

                          But let me say this:
                          The MHRM differs from the feminists in what kind of society is envisioned in the end. I'll omit giving detail, I'm sure you can fill in the blanks.
                          But that is a matter of long term strategy.

                          When it comes to day-to-day tactics, yes, MRAs think, speak and act like Feminists, and should do so, too.
                          Deconstructing the cultural messages about sex and gender is hard work, but a crucially necessary one.
                          A dirty job, but someone's got to do it.

                          And being an MRA doesn't mean you can't say nice things about e.g. Karen S..
                          It just means that one says nice things about Karen S. because she's Karen S., not because she is a woman.
                          Karen S. is a good person; however, that goodness is not rooted in her womanhood, but in her Karenhood.

                          Perhaps time to eliminate the gender perspective, here, too?

                          M

                          Yes, you're right all the way down the line in every one of your points-- and that's why you're wrong ;-)

                          What I mean is that there are a lot of people who are followers and don't do much of their own thinking. They're the ones who are always looking for "mysticism", or the "magic circles", or the "pyramid power"-- or whatever the latest voodoo fad is. Doesn't matter how outlandish, unscientific or downright stupid it is-- logic doesn't just fail them, it flees before their mighty new age mojo. For people like that-- particularly female people-- Feminism provides them a "buffet of goodness" from which to snack. A little of this, a pinch of that, and a dash of that other stuff-- and voila, they have an instant "philosophy" they can use to club everybody else over the head with.

                          We usually talk about the Male Feminists (along with the White Knights and Manginas) as our main opponents-- and of course in a way they are, they certainly represent the "Hard Power" (by proxy) that Feminism generally has to wield-- but its "Mystical Girl", along with her sassy sisters, who make up the vast bulk of the "Feminist horde" who, with all their baubles and beads, are down with "the struggle" to "end female oppression" as they sip their double-lattes and don their pink pussy hats and go marching down the street so they can "fight for their rights". Those are the ones that the radicals write their slogans for. Those are the ones who believe in the "wage gap" and "rape culture" and "The Patriarchy". Those are the ones who so casually inflict damage onto the men in their vicinity with their pre-formulated views, their canned feminist maxims, and their smarmy platitudes, all carefully-crafted into 240 characters bites that they can regurgitate without a second (or first) thought. These are the ones who are swayed by social trends who don't really have any actual grief or gripe with men-- it's just trendy to be "anti-man" / feminist / tragically-hip / sjw victim-- and to attend all the rallies and speeches, and go shopping for new outfits so they can impress the boy in the black shirt with the baseball bat...

                          The problem for us is that they have a purse full of dollars. It doesn't matter where the money comes from, only that it's in their hands to spend it. And that's how and why they get all the attention-- not that they are cognizant enough to realize it, or savvy enough to figure out what to do with it if it ever occurred to them. They are the sheeple, the Feminist cannon fodder-- and the target du jur for the big multi-national conglomerates who are busy raping our planet in their never-ending zeal to acquire it all, rule it all, and hold sway over every rock and living thing in all of known creation. They have all but broken the back of traditional society, just about vanquished the "real men", and are now laser-focused on this trendy lot as their key to ultimate victory.

                          But even as their mystical vapidity offers the mega-corporations their greatest toehold to glory, so too is it also their biggest weakness-- and they are well aware of it. That is why they work so very hard to control the sights and sounds so as to constantly apprise and influence these weak thinkers in their attitudes, thoughts and beliefs. They are busy leading them around by their nose rings as they spoon feed (or force-feed as needed) whatever "News" and "Information" has the most beneficial effect. Of course they have to do it in little doses and dollops in order to keep the few who remain capable of independent thought from seeing too much of the big picture or for too long-- and they sprinkle little diversions throughout the system to keep them busy and distracted so its harder for them to rally any support or muster up any serious resistance.

                          And of course the men don't much matter in this social democracy-- whose rules and modes shift this way and that, in accordance to the trends and attitudes pushed down through the corporate media. They have been broken-- cultured and cowed into submission-- not to the women directly, but to the Almighty State which the women control indirectly-- though they don't consciously know it or realize it through their thick lenses of personal "victim-hood". The only concern for the men is that they keep toiling away and producing, and are kept impotent through constant strife, shaming and blaming, and of course ineffective diversions such as gaming, whacking off, and engaged in other trivial pursuits. It doesn't matter much what as long as it doesn't permit them to come together and compare notes, or develop any sort of common understanding or ability to act collectively.

                          And they can have all the "Free Speech" they can eat-- as it doesn't really matter at the end of the day. They are so beaten down and ineffective that it doesn't matter what they say. Or who they say it to. As long as the corporate-controlled media is able to inject their element of "shame and blame" and cast their dispersions so that the men are kept in a state of constant unrest and incapable of coherent action. It even works to their advantage after a fashion when a percentage of the men act to reinforce the bullshit they're feeding the women and become the White Knights and Manginas, and thus help "police" their own ranks-- effectively for free-- in a veritable ideological "twofer".

                          The upshot is that in order to "drain that swamp" and siphon away the mystical masses, it is necessary to construct a counter-narrative for them to follow-- and then figure out how to make it trendy and hip so that the "savvy sisters" will pick it up and parrot it throughout the fickle forest of feminine frivolity. In other words, give them something new to do-- think about, believe. Wrest them away from their corporate overlords and inject them with new 240-character platitudes to propagate. We are talking about a "hive-mind" here, the center of the herd-- where they don't think or react like you and I do. Simple maxims rule the day. And anything that spooks them, they run for their "man"-- who has now become the State. So while it is necessary to target the State, and by extension, the power it wields in the form of "men"-- it is also necessary to target the herd and inject new some maxims, and work to reshape their 50+ year instinct to rely on the State instead of their individual men. We have to work on the Men too, because as weak and disrupted as they are, they are not likely to be seen as "viable" candidates for "husbands" (protectors / provisioners) in their current beaten-down state. So the problem is ultimately several-fold, and its response needs to be considered and specifically constructed to target the specific stratum of the social order which needs to be affected. There are already a number of plans and challenges underway to address other various aspects of this overall situation. My point in this post / thread is that we *also* need to develop a strategy for relieving the proponents of hateful Feminism from their easily-swayed, easily-led-- easily-duped band of followers. Because *THAT* is what Feminism offers them. And at the very small price of simply "tossing your man under the bus"-- a cost which we've seen all too often and to our own detriment, that women seem quite willing and prepared to pay.
                          FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
                          It's time to call it out for what it is.



                          The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men

                          http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I am usually surrounded by little girls; big girls; young women; and older women, when I leave my house. In Mexico.

                            I love women.

                            The problem is, after being around Mexican women, I am ruined for American women. Even the best woman I know, my own beloved daughter, who understood everything I taught her when she was a kid, could not ever get married up the social ladder in Mexico. Something a bit subtle, but very real, different about American women. It is not fun to be around American women.

                            Most of you will never know what I am talking about, and that is sad.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by mr_e View Post
                              it is necessary to construct a counter-narrative for them to follow
                              Ah, marketing. Why dintya just said so?

                              M

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