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  • #31
    Originally posted by Mifune View Post
    I don't know with certainty who they were. But I think that given:
    1. The link I posted previously.
    2. The fact that the permitted protestors came largely with shields and melee weapons not firearms
    3. The fact that nobody got shot despite the escalating violence between the other factions.


    it's a reasonable inference.

    I didn't really argue whether it was reasonable for the author in the Synagogue to feel threatened. I was remarking the ease with which someone who's intentions are ostensibly good can have deeply negative intentions ascribed to them.
    Yeah, who those people where, and what was their intentions is anybody's guess... maybe there was a politician or someone visiting the building in front and those where his armed guards... or maybe anything...

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by Dee View Post
      - This was only one man, his actions doesn't represent the entire group, and what he did was horrific and a clear-cut case of domestic terrorism.
      I agree with most of what you say, this line is the one that I really have trouble with...

      Here some quotations about Vanguard America:

      https://www.adl.org/education/resour...nguard-america

      VA members have targeted Jewish institutions with hateful propaganda.
      In July 2017, VA tweeted, “Those behind the subversive elements eroding our culture often have something in common. Jewish influence is prevalent, invasive, dangerous.”
      VA has some paramilitary characteristics. In states with open carry laws, Irizarry, who uses the title Commander, and several other members have openly carried firearms during rallies and protests.
      In addition to distributing racist and anti-Semitic flyers, Vanguard America has directly targeted Jewish institutions with hateful propaganda. Recent incidents include:
      Shreveport, Louisiana, March 11, 2017: VA stickers were left at two synagogues.
      Lakewood, New Jersey, July 2, 2017: an anti-Semitic VA banner was hung at the Holocaust memorial.
      Houston, Texas, July 16, 2017: two synagogues had anti-Semitic VA flyers taped to signs, doors and gates on their property.
      So... This was only one man... one man filled with hate, that found a group compose of more men, all like him... but yeah... one man...

      By the way, the leader of Vanguard America have made more clear statements against the car attack than... Trump.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by oldblueeyes View Post
        Wow, I didn't realize the crowd was so tiny. Just like ants when viewed from above, aren't we?

        Why Was This 'Crowd Hire' Company Recruiting $25 An Hour 'Political Activists' In Charlotte Last Week?

        Strange.
        Yeah... I wonder for how long he drove around in order to find a crowd worthy of his car... But definitely no the 1000 antifaz other member of the forum is talking about...

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by simpleman View Post
          Drone video shows that he came from a less populated area straight into the crowd... He was not afraid and trying to escape the antifas... he deliberately seek for the crowd and runs them down with his car

          No self defence:

          I wonder how that drone came to be in just the right place at just the right time. They have a limited battery life and can only fly for so long before needing to be brought down to recharge or replace the batteries.
          FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
          It's time to call it out for what it is.
          == REJECT FEMINISM. EMBRACE HUMANITY ==


          The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men
          http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by simpleman View Post
            To be honest, I would attack the car too, after I see it mow down a crow, My intention would be to stop him to mow down more people and prevent him to escape... probably a greater challenge to avoid the people to lynch him... so did people got him and turn him to the cops? or he mow down people all the way to his escape from that place?... what would you do different?

            Would be interesting to see the opinion of the forum if the crow capture him and turn him to the cops instead of... In the video it looks like he fail to escape?

            On this point though, I agree with you. If someone had just plowed a car into a crowd where I was standing, I would either try to (A) get out of the way (B) help the victims if they were near me and something I could do and/or (C) attack the car/driver to assist in stopping them.

            On the other hand-- and I'm not making the assertion, just repeating the earlier theory-- if the driver of the car had gone in there accidently / semi-accidently / for any purpose other than looking for outright conflict and had come under attack, he might very well have panicked and backed out as fast as he could. It has happened before in a similar manner in situations that were similarly hostile. The NY Motorcycle / SUV "rampage".



            I can quite well understand how someone could panic in such a circumstance.

            Another item to point out here, getting back to Charlottesville, is that the car is not particularly "barrelling down the street" to *hit* the protesters, but rather backing out as fast as it can after it happened. Something else which to me suggests that it is something a little different than what is being portrayed-- think about it-- if your intent was to do bodily damage, why would you go slow on the way *IN* ???
            FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
            It's time to call it out for what it is.
            == REJECT FEMINISM. EMBRACE HUMANITY ==


            The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men
            http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Mifune View Post
              Was this a "nazi" demonstration or a racist / identitarian demonstration? I realize those aren't mutually exclusive, but I'm concerned with the use of language lately. Nazis can be racist. Racists can be nazis. And while by-and-large most Nazis are probably racists, that doesn't mean that most racists are necessarily Nazis.

              I'm especially concerned because of the modern language of "it's okay to punch nazis"....is leading people to call everyone they find morally objectionable a nazi. Othering people by placing them in a separate moral category, is the first step in the rationalization process to justify violence. People know it's immoral to initiate violence against another person, but if that person isn't really a person by virtue of their skin color, belief system or politics, then somehow it becomes okay.

              As a thought experiment I wonder if we could come up with other times in history where one group of people made rationalizations about why another group of people was "less human" to justify their atrocities. See how many you can find!
              As far as I understand the manifestation was about preserving some sculpture in town... I also understand that by now said sculpture have being vandalized beyond repair... anyway...

              They talk about 3 types of organizations, that is KKK, Neo-Nazis, and White Supremacists... In this forum I have talk about the first 2 only, and intentionally ignored the last one... because under that term fell people that are not really violent.

              The driver of the car attack is member of a White Supremacist group that under new leadership have turned neo-nazi.

              The difference between KKK and the neo-nazis, as I understand it, is that the KKK want to enslave the blacks while the nazis want to kill them... a fundamental ideological difference that have made it impossible for them to fully integrate... though, a much modern middle idea seems to be their solution, that is to enslave the blacks but euthanize them so there will be no more... this is the closest to a middle point between the 2 ideologies. And recently Trump, they both agree in that.

              What else? Oh yeah, neo-nazies are not real nazis. The Nazi party was closed and worked in a squares system, so you have to apply, they will investigate you, and if approved you are a member of the party... since 1945 there is not office to send applications to... so what we have is some recreationist that have adopted some of the ideology and some of the fashion... I think there is still some nazis around, but they must be around 90+ years old? If someone want to slap nazis, they should hurry because they are dying...

              The driver of the car attack, for instance, enlisted in the army but was dismissed because he failed the physical standards... so must have seeing in a para-militar, neo-nazi organization a place where he belongs to.

              Neo-nazis picked up the hate for the jews, and it is a very important part of their ideology. KKK also dislike jews, but their think is mostly blacks. Both of them now have the hate for muslims, witch might comes as a surprise, considering that Hitler was OK with them... but oh well...

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by mr_e View Post
                I wonder how that drone came to be in just the right place at just the right time. They have a limited battery life and can only fly for so long before needing to be brought down to recharge or replace the batteries.
                If the red suburban didn't slow him down he would have cross straight through the whole group...

                Comment


                • #38
                  Left-Wing Activists Target Professor Who Wasn’t In Charlottesville
                  http://dailycaller.com/2017/08/15/le...arlottesville/

                  There is a political feeding frenzy going on here. Maybe the driver of the car did it on purpose. Maybe not. I wasn't there, I certainly don't know. But what I do know and am quite certain of, is there is a lot more going on here than meets the eye. Powerful factions set this up and are using it to push their hateful political agendas-- *ON BOTH SIDES*. Trump is absolutely right to call it out. This is NOT the first time that this is happened. It is merely the most fatal to date.
                  FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
                  It's time to call it out for what it is.
                  == REJECT FEMINISM. EMBRACE HUMANITY ==


                  The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men
                  http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    KKK supports and celebrates the car attack:

                    http://amp.charlotteobserver.com/new...167303682.html

                    “Nothing makes us more proud at the KKK than we see white patriots such as James Fields Jr, age 20, taking his car and running over nine communist anti-fascist, killing one (expletive)-lover named Heather Heyer,” the recorded message says. “James Fields hail victory. It’s men like you that have made the great white race strong and will be strong again.”

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Dee View Post
                      - Aside from simpleman, what took you so long? This by far exceeds the importance of the "Damoron" case at least.

                      - Going over some of the responses, you may not have grasped what actually happened.

                      - A man mowed down a group of human beings with his car.

                      - Here it goes again in case it didn't sink in: A man .. mowed down .. a group of human beings with his car.

                      - This was only one man, his actions doesn't represent the entire group, and what he did was horrific and a clear-cut case of domestic terrorism.

                      - During stressful times like these, the entire nation looks upon one man: The President. They wait for his condemnation of this horrendous act first. And they look to him for words of comfort & great reassurance that such acts will never happen again.

                      - F'king it up is an understatement as to the way Trump responded.

                      - I'd be willing to overlook the belated condemnation had it been decent & forceful rather than one in which "both sides" were blamed. Was there another f'king Dodge we didn't know about, Trump?

                      - Being aware of their public responsibility, republicans across the country wasted no time in harshly condemning the attack, including Jeff Sessions who labeled the attack as an act of terrorism .. and that guy's super conservative and viewed negatively by minorities & activists.

                      - Forget Trump, even if there was another president and he was a racist, his only actions would be to severely condemn this attack.

                      - That's if he had any sense at all .. that's what it comes down to .. and Trump has absolutely no sense at all.

                      - His second round at condemning the attack was both tragic & comical as he started out by talking about jobs, stability, and the economy. Clueless.

                      - And you know what's funny? I think it was last month when Trump jumped the gun and condemned an armed robbery in the Philippines, labeling it "a terrorist attack," amidst all the laughter. He was later informed that it was an armed man trying to rob a casino in Manila.

                      - What a f'king joke. No wonder the Senate blocked him from making recess appointments until they get back from summer break. He's been wanting to fire Sessions and replace him while Congress was outta town .. he acts like a child, so they treat him like one.


                      Dee, I agree with you-- someone died. That *HAS* to be the main story here. It HAS to be.

                      The rest I won't particularly respond to because I both agree and disagree, and anybody else's interpretation is certainly as valid as my own. But I will say this for what it's worth. I do think the violence is happening-- at least currently-- from the extreme left. I don't know who the guy in the car was, how he got there, what he was doing there, or what "side" he was on. As far as I know that has not yet been revealed, either through admission or investigation. And in saying so, I am not intending to deflect any criticism of the extreme right and whatever part they may have had to play.

                      I believe though-- quite sincerely-- that we are all being played, and that we are watching political theatre being rolled out right in front of us-- deadly political theatre-- for purposes which are not compatible with *ANYBODY'S* definition of freedom or democracy. And no matter how you slice it, THAT is BAD NEWS for all of us.

                      But you are so right-- the fact that someone has died is the story. Whoever did it and whomever they were involved with-- should be fully prosecuted to the maximum extent possible. If it was an intentional act, it was cowardly and despicable. If it turns out that it was a false-flag operation, even more so. I don't know the truth. I am seeking the truth. I don't know who has the truth or even if there is a single one truth discernable in the evidence we (meaning you and I) have to examine.

                      Whatever it is, I am sick and tired of extremists ON ALL FUCKING SIDES. I want my country back.
                      FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
                      It's time to call it out for what it is.
                      == REJECT FEMINISM. EMBRACE HUMANITY ==


                      The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men
                      http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by simpleman View Post
                        KKK supports and celebrates the car attack:

                        http://amp.charlotteobserver.com/new...167303682.html

                        Did they do it or are they just taking advantage of it?

                        Does it even matter?

                        I would like to know the truth. And for the record, the KKK is a hate group.
                        FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
                        It's time to call it out for what it is.
                        == REJECT FEMINISM. EMBRACE HUMANITY ==


                        The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men
                        http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by mr_e View Post
                          Left-Wing Activists Target Professor Who Wasn’t In Charlottesville
                          http://dailycaller.com/2017/08/15/le...arlottesville/

                          There is a political feeding frenzy going on here. Maybe the driver of the car did it on purpose. Maybe not. I wasn't there, I certainly don't know. But what I do know and am quite certain of, is there is a lot more going on here than meets the eye. Powerful factions set this up and are using it to push their hateful political agendas-- *ON BOTH SIDES*. Trump is absolutely right to call it out. This is NOT the first time that this is happened. It is merely the most fatal to date.
                          As longs as you don't claim that a washington swamp pedophile lizard was driving the car... I guess you have not crossed the line of sanity with your conspiracy theories.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by simpleman View Post
                            The difference between KKK and the neo-nazis, as I understand it, is that the KKK want to enslave the blacks while the nazis want to kill them... a fundamental ideological difference that have made it impossible for them to fully integrate... though, a much modern middle idea seems to be their solution, that is to enslave the blacks but euthanize them so there will be no more... this is the closest to a middle point between the 2 ideologies. And recently Trump, they both agree in that.
                            What hard evidence do you have for this last statement? What can you point to that shows unequivocally that Trump is or panders to any of those groups? All I have ever seen / heard are spun claims of the partisan type and nothing actually real, substantial or concrete that establishes an actual link. I think it has been determined that Trump knows or knew David Duke and has had some dealings with him in the past. But then, so have a lot of people-- on BOTH sides. I don't hear anybody making the claim about them. But Trump himself is not (clearly and obviously) responsible for any claim that Duke makes, or that the KKK makes, or that any "right-wing" / "hate-oriented" group makes or has made-- unless you have clear evidence to the contrary. You can have Charles Manson coming out for Hillary Clinton, and as much as I hate that bitch, unless you can find a tape of her collaborating with him and/or soliciting him for the statement, you really cannot make the case that Hillary Clinton is a Charles Manson Baby-Killer Lover.

                            I see you doing your best to present the information as fairly as you can, and I commend you for that. But I am asking (sincerely, because I want to know / find out)-- how are you making the final leap to Trump being complicit and in collusion with any of these groups? He has publicly disavowed them now, recently, and in the distant past even before he started running.

                            But I will make one final conjecture-- Trump *IS* a bit egotistical (I certainly think there is plenty of well-documented evidence of that) and (IMO) lacks quite a bit in the social-ethics department, and I wouldn't put it past him-- particularly in the run-up to the campaign-- to drag his feet a little in making his statement so that *BOTH* sides can make from it what they will (with NO input from him)-- which I will happily and unequivocally agree is scuzzy as hell--but it *still* doesn't equate to collusion with any of those groups.

                            For the record, I am not a Trump-lover. I did vote for him, and I will praise the heavens that he got elected over Hillary until my dying day-- but that's the complete and sum total of my affinity for Trump. However, that said, I will neither jump on the bandwagon to condemn his every move simply because Hillary didn't win. I think he's spastic, egotistical, a shitshow, and a whole bunch of other things-- but so far, nobody has been able to positively show me how he is connected with "hate". Spews a lot of shit, I agree. Says a lot of stupid stuff, I agree. Says stuff he really ought not to and has to walk it back, I agree to that too. He's a fucking nightmare on wheels. No question about it. But is he *really* connected to hate? So far I haven't seen it.
                            FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
                            It's time to call it out for what it is.
                            == REJECT FEMINISM. EMBRACE HUMANITY ==


                            The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men
                            http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by simpleman View Post
                              Neo-nazis picked up the hate for the jews, and it is a very important part of their ideology. KKK also dislike jews, but their think is mostly blacks. Both of them now have the hate for muslims, witch might comes as a surprise, considering that Hitler was OK with them... but oh well...
                              Historically you are accurate. And even in this specific instance you are also accurate. But I think the "jews" are a stand-in for any "out group" that the "in group" wants to target and use for a scapegoat. Today it's jews, tomorrow it's "right-wingers". The day after that it will be one-legged-piano-playing-midgets-with-a-gold-tooth. It doesn't matter who gets stuffed in the box. What matters is that there *IS* a box and the media and powers that be are allowed to put people in it and use them to blame the larger issues of society on.

                              That is the problem here.
                              FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
                              It's time to call it out for what it is.
                              == REJECT FEMINISM. EMBRACE HUMANITY ==


                              The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men
                              http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by simpleman View Post
                                If the red suburban didn't slow him down he would have cross straight through the whole group...

                                But if you look at the beginning of the tape-- the one taken from the street-- there were LOTS of people he could have mowed down on his way to the center. He was *avoiding* them-- why?
                                FEMINISM is a HATE GROUP - Feminists are HATEFUL PEOPLE
                                It's time to call it out for what it is.
                                == REJECT FEMINISM. EMBRACE HUMANITY ==


                                The World of Men - Men's Rights / MGTOW / Sites of Interest to Men
                                http://forums.avoiceformen.com/showt...nterest-to-Men

                                Comment

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